Saturday, December 23, 2006

An Example Of Altruism?

Many people have wrote that there is no such thing as altruism. I must admit that I have also always thought the same thing..even though I continued to search for one such act. I have often been the lone arguer pointing out that no one has been able to uncover a single example of true altruism...in a natural setting or in the human race. I am now rescinding my previous statement. I have for a very long time..searched for an example that I could in some way attribute to altruism..and until now I have been unsuccessful. I suppose all examples are based upon your own definition of altruism. I learned many years ago that altruism is an act done by an individual at a cost..benefiting another individual not of relation to the one performing the act.

The said example concerns a chimpanzee and a human. A researcher was following a group of chimpanzees in the jungle. After some hours, he found that he had forgotten his lunch back at the research station. This researcher then proceeded to try to knock down fruit from a tree some distance from where the group of chimpanzees sat eating their mid-day meal. It has been noted that after some time of unsuccessful attempts to acquire fruit... a young male from the group collected some fruits from a tree and climbed down toward the researcher. The chimpanzee then proceeded to approach the researcher and leave the fruit for the researcher.

This instance has been noted as a true act of altruism by any definition since the chimpanzee was not of relation to the researcher (not in the last 1000 years at least) and this act was a cost to itself with no benefit. Therefore, I stand corrected on the notion of altruism...it seems to exist after all.

References
Compassion, Rescue and the Altruism Debate, The emotional lives of animals Jeffrey Moussaieff Masson and Susan McCarthy.

223 comments:

1 – 200 of 223   Newer›   Newest»
Sakshi said...

I think that you are assuming that the chimp did not have any altruistic motives - it might be attempting to befriend a man since we are their worst enemies.
But it is the closest example of a altruism that I have heard, too. Maybe I should change my question now to are humans truly altruistic?

Sonya said...

First..I agree that there could be the idea that the chimp is trying make a peace offering...but I think that goes against everything that is hardwired into them about fearing what you don't know. Also, if anything you would expect them to want the human to starve..it would be in there best interest.

Second..this is the closest I could find to altruism. I still do not believe that humans in any way commit atruistic acts. I think that everything that we do that may appear like atruism in some way is done for our own benefit..whether the feel good feeling, social pressure or some sort of guilt. The one example that I once argued as an atruistic example is a volunteer firefighter, not serving the area where he lives. If this person risks his life in an area that no one knows him...what could be the benefit?

Sakshi said...

@Sonya - You are forgetting the heroism is a strong driving force in human altruism. So the firefighter benefits no matter which community he serves.
@ the Chimp example- I agree,it is the closest example of altruism I have ever heard.

Anonymous said...

Is there a conceivable world, story, or specific action in which an organism sacrifices a vital need for the benefit of another organism? What about an organ donar who willingly donates a vital organ for an unknown recipient? And if this is an attempt to conceive of an altruistic action, might the action be qualified with the stipulation that the donar did not sacrifice out of guilt or outside social pressure, but simply out of a desire for the benefit of the other. Of course, just because an action is capable of being imagined does not necessitate it can exist in reality. And, I certainly do not have an inclination to want to do that, nor do I know anyone else who does.
Of course, its one thing to ask if the possibility of altruism exist. Its another to ask if it is healthy, or valuable, in any particular way. How might it be valualbe? Or not?

Revealed said...

The interesting part of the altruism debate I think is the difference between proximate causation and ultimate causation. What the chimp did might seem proximally puzzling but ultimately not so, yeah?
I must admit I'm not a believer in altruism if we're using the true sense of the word (or at least as it was initially intended), so I might be prejudiced

Sonya said...

@revealed - I agree that there is a difference between proximate and ultimate questions. However, I believe the end result is the same. There are many ways to question and examine anything and everything. And I think that is the most important aspect: to question.

I believe there are many things that seem like altruism, for example, vampire bats. If they do not feed within two days...they will die. If one bat, not of relation, realizes that another has been unsuccessful, he/she will regurgitate blood to the individual. However, researchers believe this to be reciprocal altruism...due to social consquences if the act is not reciprocated.

I believe the proximate causes to be very interesting in many cases. It makes you wonder about the thought processes of individuals, as well as, species.

Revealed said...

Or lack thereof (of thought process of the individual I mean). And the power of the selfish gene :). I agree on all counts.

Anonymous said...

If the doer derives pleasure out of the act of altruism, would the act still be considered altruistic, given that the 'zero benefit' criteria is violated?

If not, then, the only acts that can be considered altruistic would have to create displeasure for the doer. Now, the act of being displeasured while being altruistic should create a sense of satistifaction in him, which contradicts itself. That, or it should appeal to his sense of righteousness, which I suppose must satisfy him in some way... thereby removing the displeasure out of it. Either ways, altruism loses.

So, the zero benefit concept seems to be too restrictive. By definition, no acts of pure altruism would be possible when the acts involve concious, replicating creatures. Ain't it?

[damn, I wonder how philosophers remain sane...]

Sakshi said...

@ Anon - You are right. There are no true acts of altruism involving living creatures. Though most Human beings like to believe that we are "better" people and are altruistic :)

Sonya said...

@Anon - Well altruism has nothing to do with displeasure...it has to do with cost. It's actually funny that there are only two animals that have sex for pleasure...so you might be asking how this peice of info fits into this reply. Well, you said that maybe that the animals derived some sort of pleasure out of it...but how could they...Sakshi was right when she said that we consider ourselves higher than all beings. Scientists are still debating whether animals such as dogs and cats have conscious thought. I agree with the selfish gene idea..I don't think that an animal does something due to pleasure or displeasure..they are more hardwired than we are....they go on instincts. I believe the acts that seem like altruism are do to hardwired instincts that tell them to react...motherly instincts, etc...or maybe they for some reason mistake an individual for kin and we already know that kin selection is a strong driving force in nature.

And right now you are asking yourself what are the two animals that have sex for pleasure....

Revealed said...

@Anon: Spot on! That is exactly my problem with altruism. It CAN'T exist because of its definition!

Sakshi said...

@ Sonya - Dolphins and Humans. Bonobos are included in this list but their reasons are based on social interactions.

Rosie said...

That so sweet. I agree, that is a act of altruism. Props on your great example!

Anonymous said...

What about the people on the plane headed for the pentagon on 9/11? what were their benifits? Heroism? was that altruistic or does that pride in yourself make give you a benifit?

stinkinrich88 said...

Hello, great example!

I have also been thinking about this a lot lately. I thought of two examples:

1. If I accidentally drop a £20 note without realising, is that altruism? It has definitely cost me, and it will definitely benefit someone unrelated. And I would gain any pleasure or respect or anything like that.

2. Taking a bullet for a stranger? The cost is my life and I haven't gained anything... This one isn't so good...

thanks!

Robert said...

I have to say that I am amazed by these posts. Through all of mankind the only example of altruism that you can come up with is a chimp giving a guy a banana. It seems to me that in this case science has blinded you from the truth instead of exposing it. I think it's time for you to get out of the lab and touch some Indians.

regina said...

that i a good example but ive heard better!!

Anonymous said...

Saving a stranger from an oncoming train, but not making it out yourself. There is no gain on your part and the deed is completely selfless.

Anonymous said...

@stinkinrich88:
The problem with the first example is that dropping the money does not fall under the Altruism category. Altruism is the "practice of unselfish concern for or devotion to the welfare of others." ;]

stinkinrich88 said...

Yeah, true. Actually, I thought about this again a while ago. I decided that altruism is impossible. If anyone does anything it's because a part of them (no-matter how tiny) wanted to do it. Therefore, if they wanted to do it, it must've benefited them in some way, even if just to satisfy their 'want'.

...Shame it doesn't exist! But I'd like to concentrate on how much an action benefited someone relative to how little it benefited the person doing it. That's close enough for me :-)

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If anyone is still here...

In regards to the definition of altruism, I'd like to point out that the zero self-benefit test is too restrictive and limiting. I believe that the real definition should be the practice of acts that benefits others and THAT ITS COST IS GREATER THAN THE BENEFIT/SATISFACTION DERIVED FROM IT.

Looking at it from this perspective, I admit that this is still debatable as it violates the economic principle of rationalism. But in the case of 9/11 firefighters, they are indeed sacrificing their lives for others. Their benefit? Heroic fame? Sure, but in anonymity? Would that be worth causing unthinkable pain on your family?

If anyone is still here, I'm doing a research report and I'd like to get into debate. :)

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